Life in Our Late Twenties

Written By Tracy Wendy

EPISODE 80 — 13 JUNE 2025

 

ABOUT THE EP

Part two of our '⁠Thriving or Surviving in Your Twenties⁠' episode is here! We're older, none the wiser, but ready to reflect on the transition from our early 20s to our late 20s (eek!). We share our expectations vs reality, if life panned out the way we imagined, and how we're feeling now that we're heading into our 30s.

 

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    0:00
    There have been so many different life stages from 20 to now, so it's hard to sum up.

    0:19

    But overall, what I'm really happy with is that I feel that I've been able to be content and really joyful throughout the entire time.

    I constantly feel lucky, like I said at the beginning, to live this life.

    And I think that's a pretty big achievement because I know it's not, you know, it's not as easy for other people, you know.

    0:40

    Hi friends, welcome to our podcast A Seat at Our Table.

    Candid conversations about the creative pursuits of Asian Australians.

    I'm Tracy.

    I'm Wendy.

    We saved your seat.

    Come join us.

    Hey everyone, welcome back to the podcast.

    0:56

    We are doing our first solo episode from opposite sides of the world.

    So hello should a time check?

    It's currently in London Sunday 10:35 AM for me.

    And in Sydney, it is currently 7:36 PM on a Sunday night.

    1:19

    So your day's your weekend's over, and I'm still halfway through my weekend.

    Wendy's in the future.

    A demo, I guess it's been a minute since we've chatted on the pod.

    Like the last time we recorded a solo episode.

    We were at my place a few months ago, so it.

    1:37

    Was right before I left, right?

    It was the London.

    Yeah, yeah.

    Oh, true, true, true, true.

    Yeah.

    Tracy, tell us, how has the move been?

    What's it been like living in London?

    Give us the download.

    Like where do I even begin?

    1:53

    I think there's like a lot to unpack.

    This could be a whole nother episode probably about my London experience so far.

    But I've been I arrived in London in mid February.

    So it's coming up to four months, right?

    I'm currently, I don't know, less overwhelmed.

    2:11

    It's been very, very overwhelming and very overstimulating in this city and coming into a new city, not really knowing a lot of people.

    And then I, for those who don't know, I started work six days after I landed and I was still on my friend's couch at that point.

    2:30

    I was still looking for a place to live.

    So I feel like I haven't had a break in terms of like to like let it soak in.

    You know, it's like hit the ground running.

    And I didn't take a break really from my last job either.

    So I remember the first like 2 months just being really overwhelming.

    2:49

    Like really fun, like a lot really, really fun.

    Like it's the social life here is like pop it off because there's a lot of Aussies here and a lot of Asian Aussies here as well who are like super open, like minded, extroverted social, you know, people who want to make friends.

    3:06

    So like I'm literally meeting people constantly and it's so fun.

    But there's like it's the, the pace is different, different here.

    It's just really go, go, go, go fast as fast.

    Weekends are like filled week, week nights are filled.

    It's really fun.

    But I would say it is, it's been overwhelming, but it's starting to settle down a little bit.

    3:26

    Yeah, I feel like you were unsettled for a while because you were like looking for a place and then things went working out.

    But also work was really crazy.

    Yeah, but also, I feel very lucky like that.

    That was the thing that when I first got here, I was like, Oh my God, I'm getting so lucky because I was lucky to have a friend shout out to my friend Julia, who let me sleep, like sleep on her couch and stay at her place.

    3:47

    And then I was lucky to come to the city with a job.

    Often people take months and months and months to find a job.

    So I was like kind of financially secure from the get go.

    It's such an expensive city.

    So I'm really lucky for that.

    And then I was lucky that I had like friends of friends who introduced me to their friends and I was able to quickly find my community, my people.

    4:08

    And then it was lucky to find volleyball here.

    I was lucky to make friends, like I've made like some really, really solid friendships with people here.

    And it's all in my like 2 months of coming here.

    You know, it could be, it could have been a really completely different experience, a really lonely experience.

    And then finding a place to live as well.

    4:25

    Like that was via luck because one of my friend, it's like a long story, but he stayed in an Airbnb and like I've moved into the, the Airbnb Hostess place.

    Just a really long story, but yeah.

    Yeah.

    So very, very lucky.

    I think that's like lucky.

    4:41

    But it is over stimulating here.

    Like it feels like the city is constantly screaming at you.

    Yeah.

    But in a good way, yeah.

    Yeah, a good way, a bad way, But I think maybe we'll talk about it later.

    But coming to London as an adult in my late 20s is a completely different experience from coming here as a student in 2017.

    5:04

    Like I was definitely experiencing London through rose tinted glasses when I came here.

    And when I came here, I fell in love with the city.

    Like I, you know, we did all our Europe travels in on exchange.

    And I always came back to London.

    I was like, I freaking love this city and I want to come back to this city.

    5:19

    But coming here again now at this stage in life, it's kind of a different experience.

    And I don't know if I can say that I love it yet Here, Yeah.

    Well, we'll have to unpack that.

    Yeah, in life stages it changed, you know.

    Yeah, yeah.

    But that's kind of where I'm at at the moment.

    5:37

    I think I'm starting to get into a routine setting in.

    The only thing is that I've been so overwhelmed that I haven't even like planned any travels or anything like that.

    And a lot of Aussies who come here, they're constantly travelling, but I've been a bit tired and I haven't had the time to even plan travel plans.

    5:53

    So that's kind of summer is coming up.

    So hopefully I can travel a little bit more, but this isn't a lot.

    A lot, a lot is what is all I can say.

    It's a lot.

    But yeah, anyways, how's life in Sydney?

    Well, Sydney is Sydney for me specifically, I guess.

    6:12

    I think I mentioned in the last couple of episodes that I was starting my floristry course and at the point that we had recorded our last episode, I'd either had just started or hadn't started yet.

    But I'm now signed up for it or something.

    Yeah.

    So I'd like signed up for it.

    6:28

    I'm now officially three or four months in, which is so crazy, which is like almost like the half halfway mark.

    Yeah, four months in and it's been quite an interesting experience having to go back to study a skill.

    6:45

    I can draw so many parallels to my life when I was studying design, where at the beginning you're trying to find your feet, you're trying to define who you are as a designer.

    You're also trying to, like, figure out what is your style, where do you want to go, What do you want to do with this new skill?

    7:03

    And I'm experiencing the same things with floristry.

    Where I'm learning a new skill, but I'm also thinking about where do I want to take this?

    And I think I've been overwhelming myself a lot because I've been trying to enjoy it.

    However, I being the perfectionist that I am and the high achiever, I'm constantly thinking about where to next.

    7:24

    What can I do to make the most of this?

    And I haven't necessarily been kind of just enjoying the ride.

    And so I guess like it's been a lot of up and down of oh, enjoying what I'm making and enjoying what I'm doing and learning with like other people, but then also pressuring myself to kind of have a plan after this as well.

    7:46

    And so I think that has led to less enjoyable times because I'm constantly thinking about the plan.

    At certain times I'm like, am IA failure, just having that like imposter syndrome kind of chat.

    But I know that I'm just being myself and just overthinking everything.

    8:02

    So this has been like and enjoy a couple enjoyable couple of months but also like quite stressful.

    Stressful.

    Yeah.

    So what's how far along into the course are you now?

    So I've done my first block, which was learning all about bouquets and that was cool because I feel like that's the most transferable skill to like understanding where I could get potential clients from.

    8:27

    Because people understand like bouquets is a thing.

    It's very easy to kind of like purchase an item, you know?

    So I can see how that could translate directly to me starting now getting business and all that kind of stuff.

    But I think I've realised that like, making bouquets might not be my favourite thing.

    8:45

    And now I'm into the second block, which is more so table arrangements, styling in a vessel.

    So in like a vase or in flora foam or chicken wire, which I love a lot more because I could say, take a step back and look at the thing that I've created and I feel like it's a work of art as opposed to a bouquet.

    9:08

    You're holding it, you've only got like almost one chance to kind of get it right.

    And then otherwise you have to start over again.

    So I feel like it's more aligned to the way that I like to create.

    And I almost feel like I'm learning about myself again as a creative and how I like to, you know, think about things, have a vision, plan for it and kind of pull it together.

    9:31

    Yeah.

    So it's a very, I don't know, I feel like I'm just learning so much about myself again, almost like when I was at the start of uni.

    But it's like, oh, that's so nice though myself.

    Yeah, it is like.

    Even though it's like really stressful, at least you're like, you're kind of learning stuff from and like you said, the kind of things that challenge you, things that you'd like.

    9:49

    Yeah.

    Do you find less pressure now that you're in Block 2?

    I think like in class, I'm a lot more in flow, whereas when I was in clustering, like making bouquets, I'm so stressed all the time.

    My friend and I would just be like next to each other and we'd both be just struggling, just wrangling the bouquet.

    10:07

    And we were both just struggling together.

    And it's funny going through it with somebody else because it's just like, today's just not my day.

    And you walk away with a thing that you made, and everyone's like, oh, it's so beautiful and in your mind.

    You don't feel?

    You know that it Yeah, you know that it's not amazing.

    10:25

    So it's definitely pressure that I put on myself.

    But I definitely feel more at home doing what I'm doing right now, but also thinking about, you know, in six months time or even in a year's time when I'm done, I could just be working in events or weddings and doing things for people, which is very, very exciting, but it's also quite scary.

    10:47

    Yes, but you also don't have to put that pressure off that time, like after six months, like the journey is going to keep going after the course.

    Yeah.

    It's not like the be or end or after the course.

    Like there's still more learning after that, Yeah.

    I guess my wife or it was like a big part of it as well.

    Yeah, signing up for the course was a huge investment in myself.

    11:04

    So a part of me is like, I don't want to waste that time or this opportunity, you know.

    So yeah, that's.

    The the high achiever in you.

    Yeah, yeah, definitely.

    But other than that, my life has been pretty much same, Same.

    Nothing crazy, nothing new, I'm just enjoying the slow paced life now, you know, with.

    11:23

    Like are you able to have a slow paced life with your, you know, forestry taking up like your weekend?

    Like do you feel like what's your stress levels?

    What's the mental health check like?

    How are you?

    Umm, I keep.

    My weekends pretty free.

    I'm not going out on like Fridays and Saturdays because I feel like I need a lot of rest and I like that I'm prioritising rest, but also going to the gym, which is quite nice because I feel like I've finally figured out like the routine that I need to feel mentally well, you know, but on Sundays that's like my social day.

    11:55

    So usually I'll have like something booked with a friend or you know, today I went to watch one of our friends play volleyball, which is quite nice.

    So something to just revive, you know, the social side of me.

    Otherwise I'm just in my own little bubble, constantly seeing the same people.

    12:11

    It's like work, the floristry school and then my partner and that's it.

    And actually I've been craving like a lot of social time, which is interesting for me because I thought that at this point in my life, I'd be very independent, which I am.

    12:27

    But I feel like I want to see my friends.

    I want to have, you know, time together just to do whatever, but.

    Yeah, with social beings at the end of the day.

    Yeah, 100%.

    But yeah, it's, I feel like apart from like the stress that I've put on myself, I'm good.

    OK, that's good.

    12:46

    Anyway, I feel like we will talk more about this throughout the episode, but I guess as you may have guessed from the title, we're going to spend this episode talking about life in our late 20s.

    I guess you can think of this as like a continuation from an episode that we had in season 1, which is crazy.

    13:06

    Right.

    That's really crazy.

    Yeah.

    Season.

    One in back in 2022, Thriving or surviving in your 20s was the title of the episode.

    So if you've been around since then, thank you.

    This is almost like the Part 2 to it because we are now in our late 20s.

    13:24

    Tracy's 28.

    I'm 29 going on to 30, and Tracy will be going on to 29 soon.

    And we wanted to reflect on, you know, this decade as a whole, what has been like growing up and, yeah, living through our early 20s through to our mid 20s and now our late 30s.

    13:43

    Well, not late 20s, late 30's, the late 30s.

    Shit, Yeah, yeah, it's it's actually like it feels like a full circle moment almost, because a lot of things we, I like, I listened back to that episode.

    A lot of things have changed.

    A lot of things hasn't changed.

    But it's still really wild to me that we were in our mid 20s.

    14:01

    But we know early, no, mid, early.

    When we recorded that episode, you mean?

    Yeah, yeah, yeah.

    You were 24 and I was 25.

    Yeah.

    So basically we were in our mid 20s and like, now we're like approaching 30, which I know we're still like, very, very young, but it is like coming to the end of a chapter of our life.

    14:22

    Yeah.

    So it is emotional.

    You know, it's just like, wow, like so much has changed.

    Yeah.

    So yeah, I think you'll be a nice year.

    Yeah, yeah, 100% yeah on that.

    How do you currently feel about being in your late 20s?

    I feel blessed to be alive, to be honest, getting deep.

    14:42

    But you know, I feel like very lucky to be alive in my 20s because we still have so much energy in US.

    We're still like experiencing new things.

    We're in like a financially stable position.

    I'm literally halfway across the world and living out my dream.

    15:00

    You know what I mean?

    Like, yeah, I've been working towards going to London for since 2017 or like even before that because I guess we want to do exchange everything like that.

    And the fact that I'm like here now, it still feels very surreal, but I feel very like grateful for my 20s and grateful for the life I've had because I've been able to experience so much.

    15:21

    It's been so rich, like my life has been so rich.

    And I just feel lucky.

    Like honestly, I just like I think I said, I said this is my Japan on my Japan soda strip where I was just like walk down the streets and I'm like, oh man, I'm so lucky to be alive.

    I like to experience the world and experience this and, like, have so much fun in life.

    15:41

    Yeah.

    I'm just enjoying myself.

    Like, you know, there are really tough days and things can get really shit.

    But when I do take a step back, like we've had a really colourful life so far and it's only like, yeah, hopefully the beginning, yeah.

    You've put it put it in such like a nice way because I think I don't think I reflected on the last decade until we decided we wanted to do this episode.

    16:07

    And I agree with you that whilst we do feel old going into our 30s, yeah, we've only been living for 30 years and I feel yeah, like we've had a lot of shared experiences, but as individuals we've experienced so much and can reflect on so.

    16:27

    Much I'm gonna cry.

    Like I'm just like getting emotional with you.

    Oh, life.

    The other day I was walking down the street and I, I don't know how to describe this is a better way.

    I literally said to Chris, if I die tomorrow, I'm content.

    16:46

    No, no, like, as in as in like I will die with no regrets.

    Yeah, that is exactly.

    I agree what I said.

    And it's because I've been able to live the life that I have.

    Yeah.

    And have like friends like you and also like the experiences that we've had together, like starting this podcast.

    17:06

    Like, what the hell?

    Like I never thought in my wildest dreams, it wasn't, It was never a dream.

    But it's like, how lucky are we to have the time and the space to be able to create ways for ourselves to, you know, leave this world in a better place.

    Yeah.

    17:22

    And that's why like, for me, like, apart from feeling blessed, like you, I think I feel very, very content with the life that I've like lived up until this point because I've been able to do whatever I wanted to do and not have to apologise for it, you know, And to be able to look back and feel like I really like lived in my 20s to where I am now.

    17:43

    It's like, I absolutely have no regrets of like where my life has gotten to now.

    And like you, like there was some shit.

    Times like there still are some shit times, you know?

    Yeah, exactly.

    But it's like, in the grand scheme of things, it's like we have like a pretty cool life and it's like we're so lucky to be the ones living it.

    18:01

    Yeah, I agree.

    And like what you said about reflecting on our 20s is like, so hard to sum up your 20s in like 1 sentence, but honestly, our years, like since high school, every single year has been like up and up and up and up, you know what I mean?

    Like it's just been like like such like it's been good.

    18:18

    Like, yeah, obviously there's been shit years, but in general it's been a really good life so far.

    And every year has been so different and like all the goal, all the goals that mean you have set for ourselves, each other, the podcast, like each year we keep achieving them, you know, it's like manifesting or some shit, you know?

    18:35

    But like, it's been like, I don't know, I just feel like maybe it's like we're surrounded by the right people or like, you know, exactly universe, like the universe is on our side, but I just feel like it's, we've been very lucky to live this life.

    Yeah.

    Well, I guess like where did you think you would be like reflecting back on say like the start of your 20s, where did you think that you would be in your late 20s?

    18:59

    And I guess like, how do you feel now that you've arrived here?

    I know you spoke about like London, but just in general other.

    Things I don't know, like I actually, I don't know if I was thinking that far.

    Like I remember like London was such a thing.

    Like that was like the biggest thing on my cards.

    19:16

    I was like, before I hit 30, I'm I have to go over to live in London.

    And now that I'm there, it's kind of like, hmm, what do I do now?

    Just just live.

    Just live.

    It's just like, what's your next goal in life, you know?

    Because now I'm here, I'm like, oh.

    19:33

    What do I have?

    Now, yeah.

    So in a in a way, I feel like I am where I wanted to be in my late 20s.

    I don't know whether necessarily I thought about marriage, kids and all that stuff.

    Because listening back to that thriving in your 20s, surviving or thriving in your 20s episode we did, I remember I said if I'm not stagnant by the time I'm like reaching 30, then I'll be happy.

    19:58

    And I feel like I'm not stagnant right now.

    And I think I also said if I'm settled by the time I'm 30 that will be a problem.

    Yeah.

    So I feel like I feel like aligned.

    Yeah, yeah.

    I feel like it would have been so different if you weren't in London.

    20:14

    You would feel completely different, right?

    Like, that's true.

    Yeah, that's true.

    Almost be the opposite.

    But I'm really glad we're recording this episode at this point in like your life as well, because I think it is a full circle moment seeing you reach that milestone that you set for yourself almost like 10 years ago.

    20:35

    Like in since.

    Yes, yeah, you came back in 2017.

    You were like, I'm going back to London.

    Yeah.

    So it's.

    Been like 7 years, seven years, seven years, 7-8 years.

    Yeah.

    But it's weak because, like, that goal has changed for me.

    Like it got to the point I was like, what is, what is this London thing?

    20:52

    Like, you know, you talk about it so much that you are going to want to move to London, but it's just like, why?

    Why do we want to do this anymore?

    You know, like, yeah, every year just questioning, like, is this a real goal?

    Like do I actually want to go to London or have I just been saying it for so long that I have?

    21:07

    To you just made it.

    Yeah, you just made your reality.

    Yeah, yeah.

    But no regrets.

    But yeah.

    How do you like what?

    Yeah.

    I was just going to ask, did you have any specific expectations around like Korea?

    Oh, good question.

    Yeah, I think I probably OK as as a young person, I probably thought I'll be like career, very career focus, like want to get rich, want to want to climb the corporate ladder, like wanting to like build a successful career, being a career that I'm happy in.

    21:36

    But now in my late 20s, I'm kind of a bit tired of hustling for my career.

    I want to like, hustle for myself, you know?

    Yeah, 100%.

    I think that was a theme for from our last episode as well when I listened back to it.

    We're both so like career focus.

    We're like by our late 20s, I want to be, you know, really content with my career.

    21:56

    I want to be reach all these like Korean milestones.

    Yeah.

    And I think we were both very, very focused on just like making it.

    Yeah, but we were coming out of COVID and I think we were also getting tired.

    Like I'm pretty sure we would.

    Like the sentiment was that nobody was hustling as hard anymore, like after COVID.

    22:13

    So that's really changed things.

    But yeah, are you like, does do your 20s, do your late 20s look like what you expected?

    Also like you're on your last leg before you turn 30 this year?

    And I remember you talked to, hey, you talked about what was it like 29 things before the wait?

    22:28

    Is it?

    What was it the Oh my bucket?

    Your bucket list?

    Bucket list.

    Yeah.

    Oh, I haven't.

    I haven't been living by that, actually.

    I totally forgot about that.

    Thanks for reminding me you're.

    Oh, so your best, your best, Yeah.

    What was the idea?

    It was like my best year yet.

    And then I.

    Was gonna see you, yeah.

    I had, I was gonna have like 29 things on a list that I needed to tick off.

    22:48

    But I think I can't live by list anymore like that.

    It's just too much, too much for me.

    But I did kind of have the mindset that my last year of my 20s was going to be my best year yet.

    Yes.

    And how's it going?

    It's going good.

    I think I'm, I'm very like content and I think I'm settled.

    23:07

    I'm very happy with where I'm at.

    I'm not, I think in my early 20s I was such a go getter.

    I was just constantly chasing what I thought was the next big thing, whether it be like a life filled with travel, you know, a career milestone or you know, I hope would have like a very successful business or chasing the next big idea, that sort of thing.

    23:32

    It was just a mindset that I had where I was like, I want to just keep going and I want to keep hitting these like milestones.

    I don't want to just settle for, you know, being OK with where my life is AT and just doing ordinary things.

    Yeah.

    But I would say now I feel like I live in my in my eyes, I feel like I live a pretty ordinary life where.

    23:54

    I have a my own.

    Place I am in a long term relationship.

    I have a dog.

    It's like the white picket fence life, but like Sydney version, you know, it's like.

    A happy little life.

    Like that's how I refer to it like that.

    It's like a happy little life.

    It's not an ordinary one, but it's like your little, happy little life.

    24:10

    Yeah, like Wendy's life.

    My life and I'm, I'm very happy living it the way that I have been.

    And I don't think Korea is the front of my mind anymore.

    I'm not trying to constantly, you know, kick goals and I feel shit if I don't kick any goals.

    24:28

    I think I enjoy the little things in life so much more and I find joy in them just each day as much as I can.

    And I think a lot of it is because, like, honestly, I feel like getting a dog like makes you really, really like motherly.

    Yeah.

    24:43

    And I look at my dog and I'm like, you know what?

    I'm his entire world and also he's my entire world.

    And I'm OK with that.

    And I feel like it just brings so much into perspective because it doesn't take a lot to make to feel happy.

    25:01

    And I feel like the, the life that I've crafted for myself genuinely makes me happy.

    So I'm, I'm very kind of settled, but in a really, really kind of like good way.

    It's not like, you know how you framed it where you were like, oh, if I'm settled, it's gonna be a, a bad thing.

    25:16

    I think I'm like the complete opposite, actually.

    Yeah, I'm pretty happy with where I'm at.

    And I realised that I have, I have the same friends and the same friends that have stayed consistent for say the last like 5 or even more years since like exchange since 2017.

    25:35

    I've kept my circle of friends the same whilst there have been people who've come in and out my immediate circle like, you know, my board of life directors has stayed the same.

    So I really feel like that's a testament to just how consistent I've been letting people in and out of my life and staying true to myself and, you know, engaging the right people who I think aligned with my values.

    25:58

    And I think that has what has led to also feeling like quite content with where I'm at as well.

    Because I think a big part of my life is my social life.

    And if I wasn't content with my social life, I'd think I'd feel quite, quite down about that as well.

    So I feel like you've built like a really rock solid foundation, you know, like the stability.

    26:17

    You're the people around your life, life like it's rock solid.

    So you're able to kind of like have that support, but you can do whatever you want, you know?

    So yeah, yeah.

    Were there any goals that you had for your late 20s that you feel like you haven't met yet or then you still any itches not scratched, you know, like.

    26:34

    Yeah, I have to say I really wanted to live overseas at some point in my life, just like you.

    But I let that dream go a long time ago.

    And from time to time, I do think about it, like, when you moved, I was like, damn, I'm getting FOMO.

    26:51

    Should I?

    Should I do it too?

    But I've settled with the fact that, you know, even if I do go overseas, it doesn't tick any boxes for me.

    Like it doesn't give me anything other than, you know, like being bragging rights I guess for saying like I lived overseas.

    27:09

    I feel like at the end of the day, I will always want to come back to Sydney and I will want to build a life here and reaching my 30s.

    Like unfortunately we are on a biological clock thinking about those things.

    I feel like adding another year of living overseas just makes it really difficult because like, in the grand scheme of things, my partner can't really move overseas.

    27:29

    So with his job.

    So it's like a reality check that it's just not possible.

    So I think that's like the only itch I haven't scratched, but I'm also OK not scratching it.

    Yeah.

    So you're OK letting that go and like you wouldn't regret not doing that?

    Yeah.

    And I think I travel enough to be able to scratch that itch.

    27:46

    That's true.

    Yeah.

    This year I've told myself I'm just going to travel as much as I can, and I'm not going to kind of settle for just, like, waiting for one big Holiday Inn again.

    And I think I've said this repeatedly on this podcast, and I won't let you know, finances or anything get in the way of doing that because you can only do that for so long.

    28:03

    And if anything, I think COVID helped push that along because we lost so much time to not being able to travel.

    So I do that unapologetically now.

    I don't really care, like, how much it sets me back as long as I'm not putting myself in a financially, like, bad position.

    28:21

    I'm like, I'm just gonna go out and experience as much as I can.

    But it's OK if it's just a holiday and not me living overseas.

    I'm cooled.

    Yeah, because that's kind of enough.

    And yeah, you don't need to live overseas anymore.

    Yeah, yeah.

    So looking back at your 20s, like what have your biggest achievements been?

    28:41

    I read this question, but I was thinking about it as like more milestones.

    I think exchange was a really big milestone, like the most memorable.

    I'm thinking about this as the most memorable parts of my 20s that I always reflect on.

    I think exchange was a really big part that was I just learned so much about myself when I was overseas.

    29:02

    And without that I wouldn't have seen so much of the world, you know, And for it to be have happened before COVID as well.

    I was really, really grateful because by the time that we were out of COVID, I just realised that a lot of the people around us hadn't seen the world as much as I had.

    29:20

    And how lucky am I to be have been able to even afford to do that over an entire year.

    And also to share that experience with a lot of like, you know, my friends and my family as well.

    And then the second one, I would probably say, although I'm not a huge hustler anymore, I do feel like where I am now with my career, I'm very satisfied with it.

    29:45

    Finding a place that I truly love going to work at.

    I don't hate my life.

    I enjoy like being friends with my colleagues because that's not always the case with people.

    And, yeah, being where I'm at in terms of, you know, the level that I'm at and the experience that I have, I'm very, very satisfied with that.

    30:06

    And if I hadn't reached this point or found, you know, future friendly, I think I would have felt very, very miserable because it makes up such a big part of your life.

    So very, very grateful for that.

    And then the last one would be, like, having my own place and having my own space.

    I think my mental health wouldn't be as good as where it is now without that.

    30:25

    And also, just, yeah, just having a place to call my own, I think for a lot of us in Australia or in Sydney anyway, is a very, very big milestone.

    And I think for me, it's more so that I did it myself and that was never a thing that I thought was possible.

    30:43

    So it's crazy thinking back being like, I don't even know how I did that, but I did that.

    It's a huge achievement.

    You know, in that episode it's thriving your 20s.

    It was the first episode we did in your new apartment.

    Oh, really?

    Yeah, we, we did it on the, we did it on your floor because you had just moved in.

    31:00

    Because when I listened back to it, we said, yeah, we yeah, just bought a place.

    We just moved in.

    We were on your floor and you still, it was still fully furnished.

    So it does feel like a full circle moment.

    And I remember when you bought this place, like it felt like a huge achievement and it was something that you like really set yourself out to do for your mental space and physical space, right?

    31:19

    And then like, you're kind of like, I want to buy a house.

    And then a year later or something, you bought a house.

    It was just so like.

    That's what I mean by like.

    You made it look very easy.

    Yeah, you made it look very, very easy, Yeah.

    And you're probably one of the first people in our groups to actually buy property as well.

    So I think that, yeah, that was a huge milestone.

    31:37

    It was never like a dream of mine.

    You know how some people come out of school or out of uni and they're like, my dream is to buy a place?

    It was never a dream of mine.

    It kind of just happened alongside some of the other things that happened in my life where I'd just come out of a long term relationship.

    31:52

    And this was almost something to prove to myself that I could be independent as well.

    So I think it has so much more significance than, you know, this is better for my future financially.

    Like, that was never my dream or intention of buying a place.

    So I think it holds so much more significance for me personally.

    32:10

    Yeah.

    And to do that before my 30s and to do it on my own is like a huge, huge.

    Thing that I am glad I'm reflecting on now because I don't reflect on it enough yeah yeah can I also say and myself panel it back but also another achievement I feel like you've reached is like focusing your health physical and mental you know therapy like recovering from the concussion like girl you've been you've been on a health grind so true achievement yeah oh.

    32:39

    I totally forgot about that.

    Yeah.

    You know what?

    That I think back to that concussion and I'm just like, that was like a literal catalyst for changes in my life because we started volleyball after that, which has now become a very big part of our life.

    32:59

    What happened?

    What you met Chris?

    Just yeah, I met Chris.

    Just just a lot of things.

    That was just like, I feel like that was the universe telling me like, Yep, you need a reset.

    So this is a reset a a mental reset or a physical mental reset right now?

    33:14

    Physical and mental reset.

    So yeah, all times, yeah.

    I think that's that's pretty much it.

    Those are kind of the most highlights for my 20s.

    Yeah, gosh, it's so hard to choose highlights.

    33:30

    Like I don't, I don't, I don't really see my life in achievements and I don't know if that's like the high achiever professionist thing is like I don't know what I've achieved in life, you know?

    I'm just hard to sum up.

    It's not really like one big achievement list, but because because genuinely, I feel like it's been 10 years in my 20s or no, it's been 8 years in my 20s, nine years my 20s.

    33:53

    And each year there's been significant milestones in each year and each year has been different and there have been so many different life stages from 20 to now.

    So it's hard to sum up.

    But overall, what I'm really happy with is that I feel that I've been able to be content and really joyful throughout the entire time.

    34:14

    I constantly feel lucky, like I said in the beginning, to live this life.

    And I think that's a pretty big achievement because I know it's not, you know, it's not as easy for other people.

    You know, like, it just feels like the universe is constantly giving me things like.

    But I think it's just more I'm, I'm, like, proud that I'm able to achieve the goals I set for myself each year and kind of stay on that track.

    34:37

    But there's more goals, but there's still, like, contribute to my overall well being.

    Yeah.

    So I'm just happy that I'm happy.

    Does it make sense?

    Yeah.

    I think, though, that like, that's how we've been living our life for the last 10 years, right, Where each year we're trying to focus on something different or every six months.

    34:55

    We are such malleable beings, almost like the way that we approach life is as soon as something comes up or something that we want to do, we set our focus on that and we just do it.

    Yeah.

    And I think that's what has led to the life that we can Live Today.

    I think if I had a a plan for myself that by, you know, 20, what would it be?

    35:18

    2026, when I'm 30, I want to achieve all these things.

    I think it would have led to a lot more disappointment because if you haven't ticked off those things, I think you'll feel kind of bad about yourself that you weren't able to achieve those things.

    Whereas I think we live a life where we change as the times change and we kind of focus on different things and we kind of just let life happen with us, if that makes sense.

    35:42

    Yeah, I think the biggest thing is like being grateful.

    Like honestly, like I think if you practise gratitude every day for the small things, having a body, having legs to walk, like being able to run or things like that, like you just put things into perspective that there's like, you know, all the small things don't really matter that much.

    36:00

    Yeah, yeah.

    But yeah, I don't.

    Know were there any, like, were there any surprising or unexpected moments of your 20s that kind of changed where you're at now or change the course of your life?

    36:16

    Yeah.

    Like COVID obviously changed the course of my life completely and everyone's lives completely properly.

    Like it changed my perspective on work.

    It changed my relationship with myself and like having time with myself, it changed us pursuing hobbies.

    Like the podcast was a baby out of this this of COVID and of the podcast changed our lives.

    36:35

    Like I think it changed my life.

    Like for the better life.

    It changed our friendship as well, I think.

    Yeah, yeah, that's right.

    It changed our friendship.

    Yeah.

    It really enriched our life.

    And without the podcast, we wouldn't have met all these other Asian Australians, be part of this really like rich and colourful community and be able to talk to all these people we talk to.

    36:57

    It's kind of weird.

    Like I'm just like, wow, we know that person, you know, who's doing that cool thing or we know of this person, like everyone who's like smashing it out in this community.

    We're like, oh, we've, you know, 6, you know, 6° of separation is not even, it's like a two degree of separation because we interview such cool guests and I feel like I'm contributing something to this wider community we're in.

    37:21

    So I think the podcast, oh, actually, you know, I told my achievements, the podcast is probably one of our, my biggest, biggest, biggest achievements in my 20s.

    It's really enriched my life.

    And other things that were surprising for me is that I thought in my 20s, like you said, like how you said that your friends have stayed the same every year.

    37:42

    I thought that, yeah.

    By the time like after uni, I thought I would, I'll just like you'd only be hanging with the same people every single year.

    And after that it just becomes normal.

    But what surprised me is that every year I picked up new friends.

    Like I was able to make new friends, like really good friends each year.

    37:59

    And that's through things like work.

    Like I've made a lot of really good friends to work or like starting volleyball.

    Every year we've had made new friends and like different friends, like for the different teams we play with, the clubs we play with.

    Like it just surprised me.

    And then being in London, I've been able to make even more friends who are like, actually really close as well.

    38:16

    So I don't know that.

    I don't know why I didn't think I would make any friends in my 20s.

    But like, that surprised me.

    That was like, oh, yeah.

    There's actually so many people out there that you can be really good friends with still, like, the pot is not empty, you know?

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    38:33

    I don't know.

    Those are the kind of things that I can think about in terms of surprising and unexpected.

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    How about you?

    Yeah, I think mostly, mostly the same.

    I think I'm really grateful for the podcast because I don't think we would reflect as much or I don't think I would look back and really question certain parts of my life like, you know, how like culturally, how do we identify what our, you know, Asian Australian identity is And on just life in general as much I don't think we'll be as proud of our.

    39:12

    Identity, maybe, maybe we would get there eventually, but I feel like this has really excelled our understanding of ourselves as Asian Australians and our role in the community and like you said, like being able to reflect on like really deep things.

    Yeah, I think it's like opportunity to self awareness.

    39:30

    I think is is probably the biggest thing, right?

    And I think it's given me the confidence to really like truly bring my whole self to whatever it is that I do and kind of not have to hide parts of myself and my identity.

    And I think I'm so grateful for that because it has led to me being kind of unapologetic in everything that I do, which I think is a really, really hard thing to do when, especially when you're growing up in your 20s, there's so many pressures, there's so many expectations of where you should be.

    40:02

    There's so many, kind of.

    People telling you how you should live your life or you kind of see examples, especially in the the world that we live now where there is a lot of comparison.

    You kind of feel pressured to live your life a certain way.

    But I think because we're forging a path on our own, especially with this podcast, we've been given the chance to really, really think about, you know, how do we want to live our lives?

    40:26

    How do we want to show up in this world?

    And I'm so grateful for that because I think I would just brush it aside a lot of the time had it not been for this podcast and the our conversations as well.

    I think we're so much more thoughtful and also self aware of how we influence others.

    40:41

    It's also, like, really forced us to.

    Do more, you know, like, yeah, go to events and like, do more.

    Like normally, well, maybe we'll be too lazy to do that, but because we've got the podcasts, we should we should do this and we actually get benefits out of it.

    Yeah, yeah, yeah, 100.

    40:57

    Percent.

    So that's, that's been a huge kind of unexpected, but very, very grateful surprise.

    I think the other thing personally is like the relationships that you have in your 20s, like I'm talking, what's the word like romantic relationships.

    41:17

    I was in like a very long term relationship since I was 18, which is most of my most of my 20s, right?

    It was like the first half of my 20s.

    And by that point, when you're in such a long term relationship, you think you've got it all figured out.

    You're like, I want to be with this person forever.

    41:34

    This is what our life is going to look like.

    And so when you get out of such a long term relationship, you're like, holy shit, where do I begin again?

    Who am I?

    What am I without this person?

    What is my identity?

    And I think that was probably one of the biggest turning points of my 20s because it really helped me refocus and figure out what is it that I actually want out of this life as an individual as opposed to being like coexisting with someone else and building a life with them.

    42:05

    And so I went into, you know, my next relationship being very, very short of what I wanted and also like really prioritising myself and never kind of putting my dreams on hold for someone else.

    I think that kind of helped me.

    That moment kind of really pushed that forward for me.

    42:25

    So yeah, super grateful for that as well.

    I think everything happens for a reason for sure, and that was definitely one of them.

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    Anyway, yeah.

    OK.

    So then speaking.

    About like what you mentioned, like your LE early versus late, like what are some key, key differences between your early 20s and your late 20s now?

    42:48

    I think my probably the biggest thing is mindset, like in my early 20s, so spontaneous all the time, you know, like you just want to keep going and like finding new things to do, hanging out with your friends, experiencing life with them.

    I think my care factor when I was like younger was so much lower than it is now.

    43:09

    Like I didn't stress about anything.

    I just kind of just took it day by day.

    I didn't really think about, you know, consequences or, or any of the sort of risks.

    And now I'm like, I feel like I think about the risks all the time.

    I'm like OK, what is the?

    Implication.

    43:25

    Of getting injured on my body.

    What does this mean for me?

    Like, how will I kind of like, how will that impact my entire life if I do get injured, you know, those little things.

    Or if I do get sick?

    Whereas when you're young, you're kind of just so carefree and you're just like, I'm just living in my own world, la Dee da.

    43:42

    And you're like, so, so kind of like nonchalant about everything, but you also just want to just have fun all the time.

    Whereas now I feel like I'm a lot more realistic about things.

    But I kind of do miss, like, more settled on yourself stressing.

    43:59

    Yeah, more responsibility, but I do.

    Miss.

    Exactly.

    So I kind of miss not having responsibilities and just kind of living so carefree.

    But I don't hate the life that I have now, for sure.

    It's just like it was a different time, you know?

    44:15

    Yeah, just RIP my carefree life.

    No, you can still, I think, build.

    That into your life?

    Yeah, I think I'm carefree, but in different.

    Ways.

    Yeah, that's what I want to say.

    Measured carefree.

    Exactly.

    Yeah.

    How about you?

    44:32

    It's, it's weird because you're like, I'm in London right now, so I feel like I'm reliving my young 20s, you know, like I feel like I'm live, I'm literally living that carefree life because it's like a selfish decision, a selfish decision to come over here and just like live my life for me.

    I'm just doing whatever I, I want and I'm socialising, I'm going out, I'm being spontaneous.

    44:52

    Like, there's so many adventures every every week, and that's what I want.

    And that's kind of the thing that I want to stay consistent.

    And I think that mindset has kind of stayed consistent for me in my 20's.

    The biggest difference for me, honestly, is that the people around me are getting older, you know?

    45:09

    Yeah.

    Like, our parents are getting older.

    So I'm definitely more conscious that I could be over here, like, living my life in my late 20s, but everyone else at home is getting older.

    Doesn't make sense.

    I don't know.

    Yeah.

    But obviously I'm getting older, too.

    But it is sad because I do feel the pressure slightly to be like, OK, like, when are you going to settle down?

    45:30

    You know, like when it like when it's time to come home and like, look after your parents or like, you know what, what's the next stage for you?

    So I miss, I miss not having that biological clock like ticking in the back of my mind, like coming to London.

    45:46

    It's a bit of a break from that because the people I'm surrounded with, no one's really like, obviously no one's in the the settled life stage yet.

    But back home there was a lot of that, right?

    And you start thinking like, when should I do that?

    So I just miss being in my 20s, young 20s and like not having to worry about the biological clock, not having to worry about your parents being older, not having to worried, be worried about like, oh, this could be my last time I'm travelling with my family or this could be, you know, the last time you're living with my siblings.

    46:15

    Like in your early 20s, you're experiencing everything for the first time.

    And I miss that, like, special, you know, like how special that was.

    Yeah.

    Experiencing everything for the first time.

    Everything's so new.

    Whereas when you're in your late 20s, everything's kind of like, I've experienced this before, you know, like how new can everybody?

    46:33

    Yeah, yeah, when you.

    Were talking.

    I just thought about like, I feel like in our early 20s, especially you and I, we'll just have crazy ideas.

    Yeah.

    And we'll just egg each other on to do crazy things.

    We were like, let's go to this festival.

    You're down.

    How are we going to get there?

    46:49

    Yeah, you're down.

    I could.

    Always do that, but.

    Yeah, we are.

    We are.

    But I think it comes with a lot more strength attached.

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    It takes a lot more time to be able to say yes to things.

    That's true.

    It's just like, you free, let's go get a drink.

    47:06

    And it's like, yeah, sure.

    Whereas now it's like, oh, wait, tomorrow I have this, this.

    Yeah.

    I think your priorities have just.

    Changed so the decision making process when it comes to things like spontaneous events comes with a lot more kind of with it.

    47:23

    Yeah, I definitely missed that when I was back in.

    Sydney I really missed like being more spontaneous and not having to plan 3 months in ahead to do something.

    But now in London I can be so much more spontaneous now.

    Like everyone here is so spontaneous.

    The frequency of doing stuff is like constant, you know, it's like, I want to go for a walk, yeah sure, let's go, you know, like it's just like I'm not missing that anymore.

    47:41

    But I definitely was when I was in Sydney, which is I guess part of the reason why I moved to London to feel less restless.

    Yeah, I feel like.

    Also, like the mindset that you have when it comes to those things in Sydney, it's like we have all the time in the world to hang out.

    Yeah, everyone's very comfortable.

    47:57

    There is no end to how much time we can hang out, you know.

    So I think being in London, it reminds me of being on exchange where you're, you're working like, you're like, you don't want to say no because.

    It's just like, yeah, yeah, like everyone's only here, I'm only here for like 3 years or two years or whatever, finite amount of time.

    48:15

    And everyone here here is also on the same wavelength down to do whatever.

    So it's really fun.

    Yeah.

    But it's working out how I can bring that energy back into Sydney, which I may be, probably may not ever be possible, but you know, we'll see.

    Yeah.

    What are some things you cared about a lot in your early 20s that now you barely think about?

    48:37

    I think hustling for sure.

    Hustle culture was so big back then.

    I also think it is definitely because of COVID that that's changed significantly.

    But.

    In uni.

    I just had such big dreams.

    48:53

    And you also chase, you were always chasing after something.

    There was always something that you wanted to attain and you wanted to work really hard to get there.

    And it was almost like a badge of honour, you know, the fact that you were hustling so hard.

    49:09

    But I don't think that that's kind of the mindset that I have now at all.

    It's definitely flipped, whether it be because of COVID or not, or just settling down.

    I I'm very, very happy with where I'm at.

    And like you said, it's because I've just crafted the life that I love living every day.

    49:27

    Yeah.

    Noise.

    How about for you?

    Maybe 1?

    Thing that I like stop caring about is like being friends with everyone, like being liked by everyone.

    I'm just more like me now.

    I just like, I don't care like I'm loud, like I can talk a lot.

    49:44

    Like I don't like if I, if I don't vibe with you, I'm not going to chase that anymore.

    Like I'm pretty like I'm based.

    I'm more intuitive in terms of the people that I want to hang out with.

    If I can connect with you and I can be myself around you, then I will spend time in time with you.

    50:01

    You know, like, so whereas I feel like in our 20s, we were trying to be friends with everyone or trying to please everyone, but I'm kind of like, I'm just doing me.

    And if you're not vibing, then that's OK.

    Like, yeah, we'll move on.

    Huh.

    Thinking.

    Thinking about that, I actually just thought of, I think in my early 20s, I was really focused on trying to paint a picture of what the perfect life as like an early 20s person would look like.

    50:27

    So very like into, you know, Instagramming things, living that brunch life.

    Yeah, just.

    Chasing.

    Curating your feed exactly.

    You know, like curating my life so that it looks good to other people or like, it creates this sense of like, I want that life that that girl has, but I really don't care about those things anymore.

    50:50

    Just like, gosh.

    How ridiculous was I try to like, you know, curate the perfect feed and it's like for what?

    What purpose?

    I don't understand.

    It was literally just to socially place myself, you know, in a very particular like camp and for people to view me a certain way.

    51:07

    But now I'm like, I don't, I don't care.

    That's a nice one.

    I don't care.

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    So I definitely feel like you just become more real with yourself when you reach your late 20s, for sure.

    Yeah, yeah, yeah.

    Whereas back then you're trying to figure out like who who am I trying to fit in?

    51:23

    Right, You're trying to fit.

    In yeah, yeah.

    Whereas like, OK, we're like, we're not going to fit in everywhere.

    Like it's and that's fine.

    Like you'll find the people that you'll fit in too.

    Like yeah, yeah, can't fit in everywhere.

    You can't belong everywhere.

    It's OK.

    It's OK.

    Are there any like?

    51:40

    Lessons or learnings that you'll take from your 20s into your 30s.

    I want to.

    Continue like being a go getter, like in terms of like manifesting, not not manifesting, but like saying I want to do this and doing it like I still want that energy that I want to bring into my 30s.

    51:57

    I want to continue on the side quests.

    Like you know, we say want to do a podcast.

    So we did a podcast like saying I want to move to London.

    I moved to London saying I want to do a solo trip and doing that.

    So I just want to continue that energy into my 30s and like a really big lesson that I remind myself, actually shout out to my London friends because one of them was saying that one of her biggest lessons from her mum was that it's not that deep.

    52:22

    Like life's not that deep and that really.

    Like helps centre.

    Me like, because I think I was in a time where work was really, really stressful and I was caring way too much about, about it.

    And she was like, it's actually not that deep.

    And I was like, you're so right, It's not that deep.

    52:39

    And it, it kind of lines up with some advice that my, my previous manager gave me was like, you know, we're not out here saving lives.

    There are really more important things in your life.

    Don't get caught up in the weeds, you know?

    So I want to try to like remind myself of that when I get stressed over little things like we're not dying, you know, like, I mean, we, I guess we are dying, but you know what I mean?

    52:59

    Like we're not lying.

    Yeah, a bit morbid, but, you know, there are more and more important things in life.

    So just reminding myself that, yeah, take the bigger picture.

    Take a chill pill, girl.

    Take a chill pill, Yeah?

    What about you?

    53:16

    I think.

    Never too late to try things has been my motto lately.

    I think being able to revive that, how do I describe it?

    It's like what I was talking about at the beginning of this episode where I'm learning something new and I'm almost having the most humbling experience around.

    53:38

    I actually don't know everything.

    And, you know, I don't know how this is gonna turn out.

    I don't have a plan.

    Like for the first time in a really long time, I don't have a plan.

    And that's OK.

    It is a very scary thing.

    I think the reason why I've been like struggling with the the floristry thing for the past couple of months is because it's almost challenging my ego and my knowledge that I've built.

    54:03

    Because at this point in my career, just in general as a designer, I'm almost at that point where I'm a leader now.

    So I have enough experience to be able to guide and teach others.

    And it's almost a sign of maturing in your career.

    54:19

    And so to have floristry on the side where I don't have all the answers and I'm not the best of the best, you know, I'm not at the top of the class is a very humbling experience.

    And I think it has just made me realise that like, it's never too late to start something new because it does teach you new things about who you are and what you can achieve and also what you thought you knew.

    54:45

    But also, yeah, turns out you actually don't.

    And it's OK not to have all the answers.

    I think the thing that I comes across my mind constantly is like, I'm just living my life for the first time and so are my parents and so is everyone around me.

    So it's OK not to have all the answers and to give yourself the time to kind of figure it figure it out as well.

    55:05

    And you can't learn more about yourself unless you try new things and put yourself in uncomfortable positions.

    So I'm very, very kind of grateful for that mindset that I have towards trying new things.

    It's like being a student of life.

    55:20

    Like you're always going to be a student.

    Exactly.

    Yeah.

    No, that's such a good way to put it.

    And I'm everyone's always like, you're always finding like new things to do, new things to try.

    And I'm like, it's because I love doing that because it really challenges me to like do better and to, you know, find parts of my life that I thought I knew so much about, but I actually don't.

    55:38

    And it's everything that I try teaches me something new.

    And I think it just kind of lends itself to a really nice mantra for, like, my 30s as well, where you think that things are gonna slow down and you're gonna settle down, but life is what you make of it, so you can try new things and it's never too late.

    55:56

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    And we're still, in the grand scheme of things, very.

    Very young, I reckon people in their 50s are probably like, what the hell are you guys talking about?

    You guys are so young, you know?

    Yeah, like.

    We're all gonna go into this next.

    Chapter together and see where we are all going to go.

    Like it's going to be really nice because it's like we've seen each other since we were like what pre pre 20s like 15 or something like that.

    56:16

    Like what the hell.

    And then now we're all going to like in our 30s, like, what the hell?

    Literally another. 15 years since like we met in like year 8 and then another 15 years and some of that and then another 15 years.

    Yeah.

    But it's like it's really.

    Nice.

    It's like, it feels like.

    Oh, I'm so proud to see my friends thriving, you know?

    56:33

    I know.

    Yeah.

    How I've been feeling about seeing you.

    In London, I'm like, every time, every time someone sees me, they're just like, so how's the podcast going?

    How's Tracy?

    And I'm like, I just love this for her, just living her best life.

    Like people have said, they're like, oh it.

    Looks like you're living your dream.

    56:48

    And I was like, no, London's hard, guys.

    I just do want to say that.

    Like it's not that easy.

    Like it's not what you see on Instagram.

    Like it's a fucking struggle straight.

    Like it's been tough.

    Like it hasn't just been sunshines and rainbows.

    Like it's been a tough gig.

    But overall, I'm lucky to be here.

    Yeah, Yeah.

    57:04

    I think it's just being.

    Able to like.

    See you really, really.

    Thrive.

    But you're also being really real, like, because when we talk about what your life is like at the moment, it's like I'm so grateful that even halfway across the world, you're like confiding in me as a fact that I can still confide in you.

    57:22

    Like, those friendships are so rare, you know, And it's so easy to lose those friendships, especially when life changes as much as it has for for you and for me.

    So it's just like, yeah, just being able to kind of like witness you live your life but also maintain our friendship and watch each other grow, I think is like, oh so special.

    57:40

    Yeah.

    I think being in our late. 20s is why that's so special because like I know you guys are my people.

    You know what I mean?

    Like I'm not coming to London to run away from my friends.

    I already know that you guys are my people.

    So it's not like I'm not going to be like questioning, you know, like or like I'm I'm like it's just part of my life.

    57:58

    I have to maintain these friendships because I'm coming home to you guys.

    You know, it's not like, yeah, it's not like I'm escaping anything.

    So yeah, it's it feels nice.

    Yeah.

    On exchange.

    It was so different, right?

    Yeah, because it was on exchange.

    Making friends still, you know, like we probably feel we.

    58:14

    Probably.

    Neglected people back at home when we want exchange.

    Yeah, 100%.

    I was also like the people that kept in touch with me on exchange.

    I'm like, they're my real friends, you know, They're my true, they're my true friends.

    But I didn't have shit back then.

    No, like you never.

    You don't.

    Know it's just like yeah but now you know like we know well I guess like looking.

    58:34

    Ahead into our 30s I mean, you still have a little wow, but literally I still feel young.

    I'm just.

    Just putting that out there.

    Oh, I'm still 28 right now.

    So I'm like, I, it's just kind of stretched.

    I'm not even in my 30s.

    I'm like, it's not like around the corner.

    58:49

    For me, it's literally like 5 months.

    Listen, listen.

    Five months.

    Oh man.

    Well, for you, what are you?

    What?

    Are you looking forward to?

    To be honest, I don't think.

    It's going to be that big of a difference.

    I don't think so either.

    Yeah.

    I I'm going to feel the same.

    It's just, it's just an age for me.

    59:06

    I don't feel scared or anything like that.

    I feel like I'm actually really looking forward to, you know, just growing older because I feel like each year that comes around, I feel like I've been doing something different.

    That makes me really proud of the life that I'm living.

    I think I'm really looking forward to growing another year and, you know, looking forward into a new decade and thinking like, what do I want my life to be in this decade?

    59:31

    But I also don't want to plan too much.

    You know, when people get into their 30s, they have like an entire life plan.

    I'm like, I'm taking what comes as it comes, whether I get married, whether I get, you know, I have a kid on the way.

    I mean, that's probably not going to happen, you know, surely.

    59:50

    Surely.

    Sometime in your. 30s maybe, I don't know.

    Yeah, like not, not in the next.

    Year or so, but sometime in my 30s, I don't want to stress myself out and be like, Oh my God, I'm running out of time, you know?

    Yeah, I want to be thriving in my own way.

    I don't want to kind of have all these like pressures just because everyone else is having a kid or everyone else is getting married.

    1:00:09

    I have to as well.

    I want to do things on my own timeline so.

    Yeah, love, love.

    Just chilling, man.

    Love just chilling.

    Yeah, Haven't you?

    I'm kind of excited to like.

    Spend time with family again maybe because I'm just like a missing a miss home.

    But, yeah, I think in the last year, not even in the last six months, I've like, started hitting my relationship with my parents, you know, like going on the China trip and like being over here and, like, calling them every like, week or so like that and like, learning recipes from my mom.

    1:00:39

    So I'm just looking forward to, like, be having an adult relationship with my parents rather than, oh, that's an angsty.

    Like, I hate this relationship, you know?

    Yeah, yeah.

    Do you feel like you living in London has helped helped with that a lot?

    1:00:56

    I actually think the China trip helped A.

    Lot that travelling with my parents for the first time, that was probably the beginning and then being in London.

    It's just a shame because I feel like if I maybe if I stayed in Australia, we could have continued strengthening it.

    But at the same time, being in London, I think I'm going to learn a lot from my mom.

    Like cooking wise, I'm just kind of keen to just like spend more time with my family once I'm back home and like cook with them, learn recipes from them, like be more of an adult, you know what I mean?

    1:01:21

    Rather than a child, child parent relationship, more of like a, a friend's situation.

    Yeah.

    I think what will also help is like.

    If you live out of home, when you come back as well.

    Yeah, I think so because that that has definitely helped in my 20s.

    I actually didn't mention any of this where I think like in the last couple of years, having moved out, I think about, you know, my parents and their well being and how much I've seen them and how much like I just think about them differently and I care about them in a different way.

    1:01:51

    Whereas like you said, like when you're at home, you just get so frustrated and annoyed at them so easily.

    Whereas now because you have physical distance and also space from them, you just think about the good things and how to have like I guess.

    Good times when?

    1:02:06

    You are together and make the most of the time that you have together.

    And likewise with my sisters as well.

    Yeah, like if I was living with them still, I'd probably be fighting with them constantly.

    Yeah.

    So she just become your teenage self again, right?

    Yeah, exactly.

    But because I we all live our own lives and we all are living out of home, it's like changed our relationships, like, quite dramatically, which is quite nice.

    1:02:27

    Yeah.

    Do you feel like there's any pressures or expectations or stigma around, like, where we should be as someone in their late 20s or early 30s?

    I think it's just.

    The biological clock, which is kind of annoying.

    Yeah, Yeah, kind of.

    1:02:45

    Yeah.

    It's kind of annoying.

    Just a little bit, a little bit of inconvenience, like if I could move that out by by 7 years, yeah.

    Yeah, no, I totally agree with that.

    It's frustrating.

    It's actually really.

    Frustrating because I feel like women like having a biological clock.

    1:03:02

    I want to say like we we're.

    Like basically saying goodbye to.

    Who we are, you know, if we decide to have kids, it's literally the death of who we are right now.

    I'm not even kidding.

    Like, you know what?

    I.

    Mean like all the things we're doing now, we cannot do that anymore once we have kids.

    1:03:17

    It's my mentality.

    Whereas men are quite lucky where they can still continue living their life and not have to worry about that.

    Yeah, as they.

    Have been for like their entire 20s and 30s, right?

    Yeah, yeah, I'm sure.

    I'm sure.

    Life will change when they're obviously being a dad, but it's just like the pressure is still, it's so much more dramatic for us.

    1:03:35

    It is so dramatic.

    Like to have a baby in you for nine months, like, that's crazy.

    Yeah, that's the only thing I was going to say.

    I'm not excited about that.

    It's not that I'm not excited about having kids, but I'm just like God, like.

    1:03:53

    I know it's going to be hard.

    Yeah.

    And you're just not going to.

    You're just not going to come out of it the same.

    Yeah, it's like we want.

    Like, we want everything.

    Like, you know, in an ideal world, yeah, I want to still live my life like I do now and then maybe in the future I have kids and then also do Korea and do all this.

    But like, we can't, like, because of biological means, we have to pick one or the other.

    1:04:12

    Yeah, like you have kids.

    Or you don't?

    Yeah, last question.

    What do you want to achieve or focus for the rest of your 20s and then entering your 30s?

    I have 5 months.

    Left.

    What am I gonna do?

    Yeah, What are you gonna do?

    Time.

    1:04:27

    Time.

    'S the ticking?

    I actually think I did write a bucket list somewhere.

    Maybe I'll go back.

    I feel like you started one.

    Yeah, but to be honest.

    I'm like, so not a goals person anymore.

    Like, I have goals, but I think it's because, yeah, I don't.

    1:04:46

    Think it's because anymore in life.

    I think it's because my goal right now.

    Is so clear.

    What's your goal?

    The the floristry thing.

    Is my ticket out of full time work, living in salary life but building something that I genuinely love, would love to do every single day?

    1:05:08

    It's not going to be an easy life, but it's going to be a life that I chose to live.

    So you're saying that in the future you?

    Want to just like, quit your job and become a florist?

    Yeah, I think.

    So OK, I.

    Haven't I haven't not mentioned that anywhere?

    No, I don't think you have kind of been.

    Well, I guess that that is the goal, OK.

    1:05:24

    That is the goal that the reason why I did all of this is like to figure out if it is something that I can do as like my next career.

    Yeah, like not on the side, but you fully.

    Want to shift from being a designer to a florist?

    OK yeah, yeah.

    Because I think of.

    1:05:39

    Realising in my 20s I've always tried to start something on my own on the side, yeah.

    And I just like, I've scratched that itch in a different ways, you know, with the jewellery business, with doing this podcast, with freelancing, like I've tried to create something of my own in a lot of different ways.

    1:05:57

    But I feel like this is it.

    This is like the thing that I want to fully invest in because I can see myself genuinely enjoying it and building something out of it, and it won't feel like a chore.

    1:06:13

    There are going to be hard days, but I genuinely feel like love for this OK kind of dream that I have.

    Yeah.

    So I don't think there's like a particular goal where it feels like, you know, by the time that I'm 30, I want to be this, which I think a lot of people have.

    1:06:33

    You know, it's like by 30 I want to travel around the world to at least like 30 countries.

    Yeah, exactly right.

    I don't have any significant, like, milestones that I want to reach because I've already started to kind of try and shape out the next chapter of my life.

    1:06:49

    Yeah.

    And do that, like just all in.

    That's kind of my mentality right now.

    Everything that I'm doing is all in.

    It's not like I'm committing to five different things because I don't know what I want to do.

    It's because I know exactly what I want to do.

    Yeah.

    Haven't you?

    1:07:04

    Wow.

    I'm not as clear as you.

    I don't know.

    I.

    Don't know why I'm doing my life right now.

    But I feel like you've already reached a.

    Really big milestone.

    I think that's that's yeah.

    But like, what's next?

    You know what's next?

    We'll see, you know, Well, maybe I want to come back to Sydney, start building my little life, but who knows?

    1:07:21

    I just want to have.

    Fun.

    I don't.

    Really have any big goals at the moment?

    Like maybe you check in?

    That's so fine though, yeah.

    Because like, I feel like your life has, your life is gonna be changing so much.

    Yeah, I don't know how.

    1:07:37

    It's gonna change, but it will.

    It will, you know, it's, I think just being here is gonna change my life.

    I don't know exactly what shape or form that's gonna be in, but for the first time I'm like free falling, you know?

    Yeah, there's like.

    I'm not.

    1:07:53

    I don't even.

    Know what I'm working towards anymore and like I'm so used to having goals to work towards that now I'm like, oh, I have no idea what my goal is so maybe my focus should be to work out what my goal is.

    My goal is to work out a goal.

    I don't know, but maybe it's.

    OK, for where you're?

    1:08:08

    At now, like in the circumstance that you're in, I feel like it's so fine for you not to have a goal yeah, because just.

    You've taken it day by.

    Day goal that you had for so long.

    I'm taking it week by week really.

    Yeah, don't know.

    Someone help me.

    Yeah, SOS.

    1:08:26

    I need to work out what I'm running towards.

    Yeah, yeah.

    Well, that's the episode.

    Nice.

    I think I didn't mention that this is gonna be the last episode of our Season 4, which is crazy.

    Oh yeah.

    1:08:43

    Yeah, it is.

    Yeah.

    I've been just having like moments.

    Of like, because I've been listening to our old episode, it's just reminiscing the journey that it's taken to get here to be Four Seasons in and like, be at a point where I think in the first season, we were like, let's just, let's just interview people we know.

    1:09:07

    And then now, like, reaching out to people who are like, quite big and being able to kind of sit down with them and have really meaningful conversations and share their stories.

    Yeah, in my mind, we're just like 2 little people living our best lives, you know?

    And this little podcast is like just such a small corner of the world, but I'm so grateful for it because it's led to such big things for both of us.

    1:09:31

    Big, big in our world, but things that we can be so genuinely proud of, yeah, as well.

    Four Seasons, yeah.

    Because I still think that I'm just.

    Sometimes I'm just like, oh, it's just Wendy and I talking to him.

    Like, are people even out there?

    Like, are people listening to this?

    I know like why?

    1:09:47

    Why?

    Honestly, I don't know why.

    What are we doing?

    Are we putting so much effort into this?

    But it's very rewarding.

    And it's those little moments that show us how much this podcast means.

    And like shout out to pair like Nathan's like, you know, LinkedIn posts about the episode we did with them like, and that really made me really proud of the platform that we've created because I think he.

    1:10:10

    Mentioned something about like.

    You know, we had a conversation, we asked questions that they really get like that.

    We they got asked questions that they really get asked.

    And then it was like a platform to that truly gave Asian Australian founders a seat at the table.

    And it's like you couldn't pay somebody to say that.

    1:10:25

    Like it was just like kind of proved to me like that what we're doing has an impact one way or another.

    How small, or even if it's tiny or small, it's one person like it makes it worth it, what we're doing.

    So I'm really grateful for those moments, yeah.

    1:10:44

    I guess it's also like we're not chasing dollar signs, we're not chasing monetary value out of this.

    We're not chasing like a a certain like number, which would say, you know, we've achieved this or this is what success looks like for us, for the podcast.

    1:10:59

    Like it's just been US doing what we feel like.

    Yeah.

    And like personally like I.

    Feel like personally I've gotten so much out of it.

    Like I don't like even without like monetary value or physically maybe it looks like we're not getting anything out of it, but personally, selfishly.

    1:11:16

    This podcast has.

    Given me so much.

    Yeah, yeah.

    It's definitely at the top of the list of, like, our 20s to wrap up this episode.

    Yeah.

    Yeah.

    Anyway, anyway, so we will go into planning.

    Into next season so we'll figure out what that looks like we have no idea what it's gonna look like but we will figure that out and I think more London updates maybe bonus episode from Tracy on life in London.

    1:11:38

    Who knows?

    We'll figure it out.

    Yeah.

    Let us know if you.

    Want to hear like welcome to the London Diaries, Tracy here.

    Hello.

    It's.

    Me in my room, yeah.

    But anyways, dinner table questions.

    So first one, what is an ick that you have?

    1:11:57

    People.

    People cutting their nails in in public.

    Oh gross.

    What the heck I.

    Fucking heard someone do it the.

    Other day on like the station platform and I was just like I just cannot.

    It really bothers.

    Me, I had like.

    You can't shut it out from me.

    You can't.

    Shut it out.

    Yeah.

    And one that I have is like when people have like food on their mouth and.

    1:12:18

    When they eat and they don't.

    Want their mouth?

    And like, they just like fully talking.

    And going by the day, like just like with the crumb on their mouth and all, like people who have like boogers sticking out, I don't know.

    It kind of gives me the ick.

    Yeah, just like, can you fucking?

    1:12:34

    Like, take care of yourself.

    I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I felt.

    That sounds mean, but it's just like just use a tissue, like just one wipe.

    Yeah, I'm also like the type of person.

    That I don't know how to like tell someone they've got food on their on their mouth.

    Like I'm the type of person who like just I just let it go.

    1:12:53

    Same.

    Well, like when someone.

    Tells me I've got something on my face.

    I like get really awkward about it because I was like oh sorry.

    I'm not used to.

    Someone.

    Someone telling?

    Me, yeah, but you're just like, but I should do the good thing of yeah, I know because it's good that people tell.

    Me like I appreciate that, so I should do the same to that other person, but I don't know how to do a suddenly it's it's awkward.

    1:13:11

    Yeah.

    Can you just point?

    Yeah, like.

    Or just hand in the tissue.

    And don't say anything.

    I don't know.

    Yeah, second question, what's a compliment that brightens up your day?

    I'm a words of.

    Information type of girl.

    So I kind of like any compliment.

    1:13:31

    What's something that you've received lately?

    Oh.

    Something that I've.

    Received lately.

    Honestly just getting.

    Invited to stuff?

    Over here like.

    You want to come along?

    Yeah, people.

    Who want to hang with people who want to hang with me out here?

    1:13:47

    I that's already, that's a compliment enough.

    And I was like, oh, people actually think about me.

    I want to hang out with me like.

    That is a compliment when you're living in a new.

    Country because it can it can get.

    So yeah, it's like the fact that people think about.

    You or the fact that people like message me and like, Hey, I want to do this, you know, come along to this.

    1:14:04

    That's that's genuinely it's a compliment enough.

    Like I feel like it.

    Also, they like me enough.

    To want to hang out with.

    Me exactly.

    It goes to show that you're.

    You're a good, you're a good time, you know, like they like being around you.

    Well, I don't know.

    I don't know.

    I don't know.

    Go.

    That far I don't I don't know if I am or maybe they epitomy, but like I still feel grateful for people to reach out.

    1:14:22

    So I guess that compliments me honestly.

    Yeah, any compliment will get into my head because I love words of affirmation.

    How are you?

    So keep keep the comments.

    Coming, guys, for Tracy.

    Yeah, I can.

    Don't.

    Don't call me my.

    Physical look, I mean, you can call me my outfit and something like that, but like, you know, more like is that not good enough?

    1:14:40

    No, that that's fine, that's fine.

    But the ones that mean a lot is stuff like, I don't know, the more personal like, you know, like friendship type stuff.

    But anyways.

    Yeah, what's how about you?

    I mean, you just said like, don't, don't.

    Compliment my outfit, but I really do like that that's that's true.

    1:14:56

    I do like.

    People coming with my outfit, yeah, I think they're back, Yeah, really, it makes.

    It's like, oh, thank you.

    Like I put.

    Especially when you.

    Yeah, it's actually.

    Yeah.

    Especially when you put effort into thinking about what to wear.

    Yeah, exactly.

    Like.

    Yeah.

    Well, like, you know, like I dyed my hair in Korea.

    1:15:13

    I totally should have mentioned my career trip at the beginning of this episode.

    I was just in my head about my floristry stuff.

    But I went to Korea recently and I just decided to spontaneously dye my hair.

    But it wasn't like a big change.

    Like it wasn't like gold blown or anything.

    Like I'm just like a little bit lighter.

    But like so, we all complimented it, you notice.

    1:15:31

    Yeah, yeah, you notice.

    And I was, I was feeling like a little bit like self conscious about it because I was like, like, I've just.

    Haven't had.

    Like different coloured hair around say my colleagues or anything like that.

    So I was like, I don't want the attention, but I just like it was very reassuring hearing that from other people being like, yeah, it really suits you.

    1:15:50

    Like look brighter.

    Yeah, thanks.

    Thanks.

    I.

    Appreciate all.

    Right, Last question.

    What's one thing in your house that you'd never let someone else borrow?

    I don't have any belongings with me anymore.

    Because everything's back at home.

    1:16:06

    But but if you were back at home.

    That would never let anyone borrow.

    What can I think about?

    I don't know.

    Do you have an answer?

    1:16:24

    I don't like people borrowing my clothes.

    Oh, really?

    Yeah, well, not.

    Like, it depends what it is.

    Yeah.

    But some of like, my most prized possessions.

    That's so interesting.

    Yeah.

    Like if it's.

    Like you know, you or a close friend.

    1:16:41

    That I know.

    Will take care of my clothes.

    Yeah.

    I'm like, sure, yeah.

    But people.

    Ask to borrow my.

    My clothes.

    I'm like, oh, interesting.

    Yeah, OK.

    I never let my sisters borrow my clothes.

    Oh, really?

    That's so.

    Interesting.

    Yeah, Yeah, it's fine.

    You can ask me.

    No, it's OK.

    I'm not going to ask you.

    1:16:59

    Anymore, oh, Wendy's friends don't.

    Ask for the borrowing clothes.

    That's funny because like, my clothes is the one thing that I will be willing to share.

    Share around like, yeah, I'm like, I think it's just because like.

    I think so much about the clothes I invest in, yeah.

    And I'm just like they're quite.

    1:17:15

    Like, some things are quite expensive.

    So I like.

    What woman?

    Do you borrow that?

    That's so funny.

    OK, OK.

    OK, that's a good, that's a good answer.

    Remember my cameras?

    I wouldn't let people borrow my like my film cameras.

    Oh, true.

    Yeah, especially well, I already broke.

    My parents film cameras.

    So if that was, if that was if that was unbroke, then I wouldn't let anyone borrow that because yeah, they would break it.

    1:17:38

    But I already I already beat them two.

    I already broke it so.

    That's sad.

    Yeah.

    That's a Raptor season. 4.

    Yeah, it's crazy.

    I'm just like, I wish we could just yap forever, right?

    I feel like we could just keep talking.

    Yeah, it was definitely a long.

    1:17:54

    Time coming.

    It felt like our last yap was so long ago and also like I feel like because we've been so busy, we haven't properly yapped.

    Yeah, we personally.

    Haven't yapped even off the mic.

    We haven't yet.

    We like generally haven't we just been Wendy and I have just been talking about podcast stuff since I've been here and they've been very business like text message here and there, very, very transactional.

    1:18:14

    We've been very transactional.

    Hello, do you have the cover image?

    Have you posted this?

    When's the edit coming?

    Yeah, really.

    Yeah, like that chat we had, like it because Tracy spontaneously called me the other day.

    Yeah.

    And I was at the gym, but we chatted for like literally 10 minutes.

    1:18:32

    But I was like, oh, just missed.

    Just missed.

    Yeah, literally, that was like the probably.

    The our first proper chat since I moved here.

    Yeah, I know.

    Crazy.

    Yeah.

    Anyway, it's OK, More to come.

    Yeah, more to.

    Come well, I hope you enjoyed our yap and our reflections on our 20s, our 20s.

    1:18:52

    Thank you for tuning.

    In everybody.

    And if you've actually made it this far, can you give us a comment like can someone message us?

    Like is anyone listening to this point?

    Literally no, Genuinely.

    If you haven't made it this far episode, just message us.

    1:19:10

    It's as no.

    I made it.

    I made it.

    To the end of the episode.

    We'll be forever get grateful.

    Thank you very much.

    Yeah.

    Thank you.

    Thank you.

    Why?

    Why are there just?

    Give us a like comment, subscribe, follow and review.

    1:19:27

    Yes, thank you.

    Peace, all of the above.

    All right, we'll.

    See you in.

    The next season, bye, bye.

    Everyone.ext goes here

Tracy Wendy
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